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The System Shock remake is excellent - and Nightdive's most ambitious work yet (eurogamer.net)

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[–]Evz0rz 646 points647 points  (172 children)

I have to wonder how this would have done if it wasn’t sandwiched between Zelda, Diablo 4, and SF6.

The game is most likely too niche to ever be some type of blockbuster but man the discussion seems to be almost nonexistent.

[–]Overrated_sanity 237 points238 points  (6 children)

It was never going to be particularly popular in the mainstream. That's fine, it's still a classic.

[–]Etheo 20 points21 points  (4 children)

Cult classic status, much like it's original and the sequel, and possibly the sequel's enhancement.

[–]UltraFlyingTurtle 57 points58 points  (2 children)

Cult classic status

My neighbor's boyfriend worked on System Shock.

We all lived in a college town in California and my neighbor's boyfriend was graduating with an art degree and and he was moving to Massachusetts to work on this new game, which he claimed would be better than Doom.

I didn't believe him. Doom was so massively popular at the time, everyone at my school playing the game on their "lightning fast" intel 386 or 486 PCs.

Fast forward a year later and he's back in town visiting his girlfriend. I get word from my roommate that they want me to come over to play an early test build of the game. I'm too busy with school so I don't make it, plus I still thought the guy was an idiot for making that bold claim about making a game better than Doom.

Maybe a year and a half later, the game comes out to really positive reviews in the gaming magazines and I suddenly feel like I'm the real idiot. I bought the game and I loved it. The dude was right, in some ways it was better than Doom, especially in terms of atmosphere and story.

It definitely didn't become as popular as Id's Doom, but it was really successful and it pushed the boundaries of what FPS shooters could do, and like you said, it did reach cult classic status.

[–]Etheo 34 points35 points  (0 children)

I felt like you were gonna drop the bomb at the end that the dude was Warren Spector. I don't know how to feel now lol.

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      [–]Numai_theOnlyOne 11 points12 points  (0 children)

      Almost no Marketing at all. I've only ever heard about it in this sub on release date. On top of that without any knowledge about how the game plays it looks a bit underwhelming for a 2023 non indie game and no matte how good a game is sales are primarily done with visuals, hype and marketing.

      [–]Divinus 436 points437 points  (71 children)

      Immersive sims are forever cursed to live relegated to cult status, overshadowed by bigger mainstream games.

      [–][deleted] 14 points15 points  (2 children)

      It also has the difficult position of being in a niche genre, and being particularly old school even among Immersive Sims.

      [–]girugamesu1337 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      Fr, you really feel the old school dungeon crawler vibes in this one. Because at its core, that's what the first System Shock was. More of a proto-Immersive Sim than anything.

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        [–]canad1anbacon 12 points13 points  (0 children)

        Games that add immersive sim elements to more conventional genres can be very successful tho. See: Elder Scrolls

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          [–]Drakengard 77 points78 points  (6 children)

          Those games don't matter in regards to System Shock. It's a series with a cult following at best and this isn't even the most mainstream popular of the two System Shock games. It's just the one that needed a remake the most.

          [–]Evz0rz 19 points20 points  (1 child)

          Oh I understand that completely. I just mean that even in terms of media coverage it gets drowned out to the point that someone who may not know that they could love immersive sims misses out.

          [–]GepardenK 14 points15 points  (0 children)

          It seems to get decent coverage outside the mainstream. The game seems to do overall pretty good for an AA fps (going by n of steam reviews).

          It's intersting people phrase this as a System Shock issue. I'd wager just about any single-player only AA fps, modern design or not, would be ignored by the mainstream.

          [–]camelCaseAccountName 3 points4 points  (0 children)

          Those games don't matter in regards to System Shock.

          I mean, they definitely do. Even if it has just a "cult following", many of those followers are probably very busy playing any one of the other games mentioned, and they might wait to play System Shock until it's cheaper (they've waited this long, right?), which is very bad for the publisher since games make most of their money during the initial sales run. Not to mention all the other people with a passing interest who might've picked it up on launch day but now definitely won't because of Zelda or Diablo.

          [–]ataraxic89 1 point2 points  (2 children)

          Thats just nonsense. I was interested in this game, but wont be picking up any time soon because it is among so many other releases and I have a limited budget.

          Reminds me of how EA murdered Titanfall 2 out of the gate putting it between BF and COD

          [–]Fun_Championship_737 2 points3 points  (1 child)

          Respawn picked the date of titanfall 2

          [–]Aurii_ 10 points11 points  (24 children)

          I have actually never ever touched the original. Should I get the remaster?

          [–]hyrule5 42 points43 points  (9 children)

          Do you like System Shock 2, Deus Ex, Prey, Bioshock, Dishonored, Thief etc?

          [–]Aurii_ 8 points9 points  (8 children)

          I did play Bioshock Infinite, and all of the Thief games, and highly enjoyed all of them.

          Edit: Dishonored too

          [–]SigilSC2 34 points35 points  (3 children)

          System Shock and the original Deus Ex are pretty much the inspiration for all of those games. Here is the original, basically the same game but pretty and with a functional interface. There's a demo which I don't think does it too much justice but you'd get a feel for it.

          Also, wtf - go play Prey. It's a modern take on it by the same people from Dishonored and an amazing game. One of the techs used in the game 'Looking Glass' is a not so subtle nod to Looking Glass Studios who made System Shock

          [–]DigitalNugget 10 points11 points  (0 children)

          I'm still in love with the Looking Glass tech from the game and the nod itself to the studio

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            [–]hyrule5 6 points7 points  (0 children)

            You would probably like this then, at least if you are comfortable with old school level design similar to the original Doom. Meaning somewhat abstract and maze like, rather than realistic.

            If you are looking for something similar but with more modern level design, Prey is an amazing game. System Shock 2 is somewhere in between in terms of design. All 3 are great games that take place on a space station, with horror vibes.

            [–]Zer_ 4 points5 points  (1 child)

            The one thing I can make you aware of is expect to get lost. Compared to Thief, which is perhaps the closest contemporary in terms of release date you are familiar with, System Shock's map design is VERY confusing and archaic. You will want to reference the map often, although it can also be confusing because it doesn't always convey verticality. They explain it away in the lore of course but it feels hammy.

            That being said it kinda helps making it a game that rewards exploration like few others do, so it's not all bad.

            To be honest though, as the first ever "Immersive Sim", it's almost scary how much they got right, outside of the archaic controls. The original creators were geniuses, not divine savants, after all.

            [–]ZylonBane 3 points4 points  (0 children)

            the archaic controls

            SS1's controls weren't archaic, they were just bad. Most people hated the controls even when it was first released.

            [–]arthurormsby 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            If you enjoyed Thief you'll be fine. Check it out

            [–]GepardenK 20 points21 points  (1 child)

            The game will give you a very cozy weekend if you like the idea of exploration based dungeon crawling with a class-A villain.

            It's a quality remake that doesn't require you to have played the original. That said, it does not hold your hand, figuring things out is kind of the point, but it is also fair and not particularly difficult (it's not Dark Souls or anything like that)

            [–]Aurii_ 6 points7 points  (0 children)

            That sounds like something I'd definitely enjoy. Will look into it, thank you!

            [–]FarCryRedux 5 points6 points  (1 child)

            Yes. You can play and enjoy the remake without playing the OG.

            It's a fantastic game.

            Heads up, the game doesn't hold your hand AT ALL unless you pick the easiest mission difficulty.

            [–]ZylonBane 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            There is no remaster. There's the original, the enhanced edition, and the remake.

            The enhanced edition is, IMHO, still the best version. The remake adds some half-baked mechanics that didn't exist in the original, drops some features and weapons that did exist in the original, and has various other clunky flaws. But the remake tries to lure casual players in with a garish pixelated boomer shooter aesthetic, so maybe you're into that sort of thing.

            [–]ToothlessFTW 42 points43 points  (9 children)

            Probably not that much better. Immersive sims are significantly more niche and generally don't perform all that well.

            That said, I really don't think being in the same month as SF6, Diablo IV and ToTK was a problem at all. it was never competing with those games and the people who wanted a game like this already knew about it, leading to the discussion/hype being not exactly mainstream.

            It's just part of the genre. It's niche, but it's that kind of niche that has a decent enough community that'll probably support the game and make it a success.

            [–]GepardenK 3 points4 points  (7 children)

            I don't think it's just immersive sims. It's single-player only fps's in general that is niche, particularly AA ones.

            [–]ToothlessFTW 31 points32 points  (6 children)

            That’s absolutely not true, DOOM Eternal was a single-player FPS that sold extremely well, so was Cyberpunk, Starfield will be, Atomic Heart, and Dead Island 2, most CoD games, And way more from the past few years.

            Solo FPS is a decent genre and very popular. It’s mostly down to the fact that it’s an immersive sim, and the fact that System Shock isn’t as widely known as other franchises from the time.

            [–]GepardenK 9 points10 points  (1 child)

            Most of those are open world rpg's... They are also AAA (DOOM Eternal, for example) - I specifically said AA fps's.

            COD would have sold nothing with only single-player. Particularly if it was only AA.

            [–]ToothlessFTW 30 points31 points  (0 children)

            Single player FPS games, AA or not, aren’t niche. Most of them do pretty well, even down to indie.

            FPS is one of the most popular genres on the planet, and there’s single player indie/AA FPS games coming out all the time, so they’re clearly not that niche. Hell, they’re so insanely popular that an entire subgenre, boomer shooters, have thrived underneath that.

            Immersive sims are the niche in this factor. They’ve historically sold far less, and aren’t as known outside of those niche circles.

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                [–]BlackHoleBuns 7 points8 points  (1 child)

                I will buy day one when it's on console. I'm pumped for it.

                [–]ImportantPainting 6 points7 points  (0 children)

                I'm seeing plenty of discussion and articles on this and other subreddits, it was always destined to be a niche game anyways so I'm just happy it's gotten good reviews and at least some people are enjoying it.

                [–]OfficialTomCruise 4 points5 points  (0 children)

                The game was always going to be not very popular, even if Zelda, D4 and SF6 didn't release this year, something else would have overshadowed it. It's a remake of a game that like 90% of gamers today probably have never heard of, never mind actually play. It doesn't innovate the gameplay because fans were upset, so while it's not boring, it's not really innovative and will leave many modern gamers wanting something a bit more ambitious.

                A lot of love, care, and attention went into it. But at the end of the day it is exactly what it is, a PC only (currently) remake of a PC only game from 1994 in a genre that has never been truly successful. Anyone who expected more has unrealistic expectations.

                [–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

                The studio behind it isn't too big so they really don't need to make huge sales for a decent return.

                [–]Deciver95 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                Would have done well if it launched on consoles

                [–]Gloofa08 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                I plan to buy this but for this exact reason I held off. I couldn’t even finish Zelda before D4 hit. And I’m optimistically hoping I’m done with both before Baldur’s Gate 3 comes out.

                [–]theintention 8 points9 points  (0 children)

                Really unfortunate timing, especially after it was in development for so long. If this was 6 months ago I would have gotten it without hesitation, now there are simply too many things to play.

                [–]sox3502us 0 points1 point  (2 children)

                This is the big issue here.. too many high quality games out right now taking all the air out the room. Unfortunate since I’d love to play system shock but just can’t right now with everything else out.

                [–]Evz0rz 0 points1 point  (1 child)

                I think at the end of the day this is what I’m really getting at. I think there’s a very real chance that there are people who may dabble in immersive sims that will miss out because they’ll prioritize the bigger games.

                This also blew up way more than I expected, but at the end of the day I’ll just stick to another posters comment of immersive sims are cursed and we’ll never be allowed nice things.

                [–]GepardenK 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                Just to be clear this game seems to do very well for it self considering it's an AA project. Sales doesn't seem to be an issue.

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                  [–]whatnameisnttaken098 190 points191 points  (9 children)

                  Maybe this will give enough power to Nightdive to manage to convince Nintendo to let them remake Eternal Darkness

                  https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2022/02/nightdive-studios-wants-to-remaster-titles-like-eternal-darkness-but-hasnt-had-any-luck-with-nintendo

                  [–]Metroplex97 31 points32 points  (0 children)

                  God, I would love this. It’s different from what they’ve done, but a faithful remake would be fantastic. It holds up the same way REmake does, even without a remake. Converted to modern platforms, even if it is just the switch/whatever Nintendo platform, would give the game a new life in this recent era of horror remakes.

                  [–]f-ingsteveglansberg 7 points8 points  (2 children)

                  Is it just Nintendo they have to convince? Nintendo own the IPs and patents, but I am not sure if they own the game. I feel who ever bought Silicon Knights rights out own that now.

                  [–]whatnameisnttaken098 15 points16 points  (1 child)

                  Maybe someone with more time can research it, but I'm fairly certain Nintendo owns pretty much everything in regards to Eternal Darkness. Even when Silicon Knights did a kickstarter for a spiritual sequel to Eternal Darkness, they had to change everything or use clever wording around things if I remember everything about it correctly.

                  [–]Quetzal-Labs 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                  Nintendo have renewed the trademark consistently. Every time they do it prompts rumours of a new game, but nothing ever comes of it.

                  [–]Yakobo15 3 points4 points  (1 child)

                  Pargon Pargon Pargon

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                    [–]Spader623 31 points32 points  (3 children)

                    Just as a quick note to anyone saying 'omg the release date is the worst possible thing ever', you're not WRONG... But, i feel like its getting some fantastic buzz on one place that matters immensely: Steam reviews. I'm not sure of the exact way this works but some idea of X reviews = Y 'actual' players. And it's not only got over 1,000, which is quite a lot for an... I guess not indie but feels kinda indie game (kinda? Indie is such a nebulous term nowadays) is pretty damn big. I have a feeling this will definintely be a slow burn kinda game too where people keep buying it more as time goes on and more word about how good it is comes out.

                    Because basically all of the reviews seem positive as hell.

                    [–]GepardenK 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                    Yes, it's doing very well for an AA game on steam. I can't imagine Nightdive being anything but happy about it's performance.

                    [–]zandengoff 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                    Don't know how much I represent other gamers, but this is one of less than 10 games I have ever preordered.

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                      [–]ReverESP 48 points49 points  (36 children)

                      I love Arkane immersive sims (specially Dishonored and Prey) but havent play any System Shock game. How does this one compare to Prey?

                      [–]MisterMundus 61 points62 points  (0 children)

                      Prey is basically a spiritual successor the the System Shock games. It's not as pretty and it doesn't focus as much on story and characters, but it will feel very familiar.

                      [–]ArcLight079 95 points96 points  (17 children)

                      Comparing them is a bad idea. System shock came out long before a lot of game design was figured out, including first person shooter elements, level design, mechanics etc. Immersion sim wise game is phenomenal , i wish we had more games like this . But maps are long unintuitive mazes which dont make sense, like its definetely not a space station where people lived and worked, but clearly a game levels. Amount of backtracking and obscure things you need to figure out to progress is nuts, shooting is fun but fighting later enemies isnt. Death has no negative consequences except more running around so its really an annoyance except times you cant die because it will be instantly game over.

                      But overall? i absolutely loved it , very unique experience we dont often get, and i hope they remake ss2.

                      [–]Levelman123 69 points70 points  (4 children)

                      I found a message log that explains the station was built like that to maximize anxiety to study its effects on humans long term.

                      [–]Nonalcholicsperm 38 points39 points  (2 children)

                      I love stuff like that where the game makers were at least self aware enough that their level design doesn't make real world sense so they explain it in the game world.

                      Kinda like fallout with the vaults. It doesn't need to makes sense as an actual shelter because it was all a giant social experiment.

                      [–]asdiele 14 points15 points  (1 child)

                      The Resident Evil 4 remake has a note on the family history of the Salazars which mentions one of them was batshit crazy and installed all those excessive cannons and silly puzzles all over the Castle, it was a neat touch to try to explain the nonsense level design lol (I don't think that note was in the OG, but I might be wrong)

                      [–]TatteredCarcosa 8 points9 points  (0 children)

                      Iirc the OG games did explain some of the stuff like the Spencer Manor being designed by an eccentric who also made the Racoon City Police Department building.

                      [–]potpan0 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                      Sure, there might be a lore reason added in (which I don't believe was in the original). But the real reason the levels are designed like that is because that's how levels in first-person games were designed in the 1990s.

                      [–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (4 children)

                      As much fun as I'm having with this remake, I think a Sys Shock 2 Remake would have been a much bigger hit both critically and commercially. That games advanced the genre significantly and was an incredible game on the face of it, and is also a lot closer to Bioshock in design than the first game which could make it more appealing to a general audience.

                      Although with how long this remake took, a Sys Shock 2 Remake might have taken way too long.

                      [–]ZylonBane 0 points1 point  (1 child)

                      Sys Shock 2

                      Dude. System Shock 2, or SS2. Pick one.

                      Guy probably calls Serious Sam "Ser Sam"...

                      [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                      SS is a bit uhhhhhhh unfortunate for a shortened version of a franchise name

                      [–]GepardenK 0 points1 point  (1 child)

                      Although with how long this remake took, a Sys Shock 2 Remake might have taken way too long.

                      I don't think the scope of SS2 is much different from 1. They're about even in terms of content. A remake of 2 should be more or less a similarly scaled project as a remake of 1. Give or take.

                      [–]ZylonBane 7 points8 points  (0 children)

                      Think again. The environments of SS1 are very abstract, built almost entirely out of repeated tiles. This allowed Night Dive to take those basic tiles, add 3D detail, and bam, upgraded environments.

                      SS2's environments, on the other hand, were borne of an era when 3D engines were just starting to be able to depict realistic spaces. The level geometry forms actual shapes. There are no simple tiles to update. To upgrade SS2's maps to a modern standard, Night Dive would have to throw out everything but the basic layout of the rooms and rebuild the levels from scratch, as if they were making a modern game. No tiles, no low-res pixelated textures, no shortcuts.

                      And speaking of scope, SS2 has MUCH more complex systems than SS1. It has the entire stealth system inherited from Thief. More complex weapons and damage modeling. Melee that's way better than what we got in the SS1 remake. OS upgrades. Software upgrades. Armor. Implants. Research. Psi powers. Stats. Skills. They would have to reproduce all that. The same people who didn't even manage to reproduce SS1's MFD games.

                      And frankly, I don't trust Night Dive's aesthetic sense. Their SS1 remake is full of little stupid features that they stuck in there because they're "cool". Like all the unskippable use animations that unequip your weapon and prevent you from interacting with anything else, or how item descriptions appear one character at a time instead of all at once, or how rechargers blast lightning bolts all over the place every time you use them (would YOU use a charger that did that?).

                      [–]ReverESP 2 points3 points  (1 child)

                      This refers to the original version or to the remake?

                      [–]ArcLight079 15 points16 points  (0 children)

                      Both , remake is very faithul to OG. You should just play remake, its much better and friendlier.

                      [–]potpan0 1 point2 points  (4 children)

                      Comparing them is a bad idea

                      I mean I think it is fair to compare it seeing that System Shock 1 was one of the founding fathers of the immersive sim genre, and a lot of people who are fans of modern immersive sims will be interesting in looking at the re-release.

                      But you're right. Like you say it came out in a time when developers were still figuring out a lot of the design ideas and conveniences that we take for granted now. It only came out a year after DOOM for crying out loud! So unless you're a fan of that very-1990s style gameplay and level design I think you might bounce off it.

                      [–]SigilSC2 17 points18 points  (1 child)

                      They don't, (Especially 1, System Shock 2 is better, but also aged roughly). We wouldn't have Prey without System Shock though. One of the techs used in the game 'Looking Glass' is a not so subtle nod to Looking Glass Studios who made System Shock.

                      The story is the villain. Shodan is easily one of the best I've ever ran into. Space ship, evil AI in control of the whole thing trying to kill you, and the game doesn't hold your hand at all - good luck. It's a good time, but it's not modern by any standards which Arkane put their touch on it. Arkane games feel a bit dumbed down in other ways though, trying to make it appeal a bit more to wider audience.

                      [–]Samurai_Meisters 5 points6 points  (9 children)

                      I have no nostalgia for System Shock and I think Prey is much a better game in every aspect. I really wanted to like SS, but ended up refunding it for a few reasons.

                      • The combat was not satisfying. You shoot enemies and they barely react. They just stand there and keep shooting at you.
                      • Too many junk items cluttering up the world. Makes it very hard to tell what's interactable and what isn't because everything is the same color and every surface has lights on it.
                      • UI/UX sucks. You aim at an object and instead of the name popping up over the object, it's at the top of the screen. So you're constantly moving your eyes to the top of the screen instead of focusing on what's in front of you. Same deal with the inventory. There's a little window on the right side of the screen that tells you what you're mousing over, so my eyes are darting between the mouse cursor and that window. It's fatiguing.
                        • There was also no option to turn off rumble on my controller. I was playing with Mouse and Keyboard, so when my controller started vibrating loudly on my desk, it gave ME a system shock!
                      • Cyberspace is a neat idea, but in execution it wasn't very fun. It's a fully 3 dimensional shooter that feels like it should be more action packed with pick ups and points and stuff, but there wasn't any of that. Didn't seem to be much of any point in killing the enemies as opposed to just flying past them. And I got stuck because, just like the combat, there is almost no reactivity when you shoot things. I wasn't sure what I was supposed to shoot to progress. There was a big glowing fire thing, which I shot it 5 or 6 times to no effect. Turned out I had to shoot it 7 times.

                      I get that a lot of this was to mimic the old game design, but a lot of these issues are cosmetic. The graphics look good as stills and videos, but I don't think the art design works well for a game that needs to be readable at a glance.

                      [–]lifendeath1 10 points11 points  (2 children)

                      I played the demo and when I picked up a pipe and started wacking enemies there was almost no feedback that I was actually hitting. It felt really terrible.

                      [–]YouHaveAWomansMouth 12 points13 points  (1 child)

                      I tried the demo and also really didn't like hitting enemies, no feedback at all.

                      It seems to be better in the full game. It's not Dying Light but you do at least feel like your hits are connecting.

                      [–]SixFootTurkey_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                      I am not as upset about the remake's cyberspace because it is still a significant improvement to the original, but otherwise I 100% agree with all your points, though not to the degree of refunding it myself.

                      I feel this remake is being significantly overrated, and I'm not sure why.

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                        [–]cgilber11 74 points75 points  (12 children)

                        System shock 2 is probably my top two or three games of all time. I will buy this game, but there are ton of games out right now.

                        I feel like this game is going to get a huge boost in a few months.

                        [–]bluesky_anon 11 points12 points  (8 children)

                        What's the rest of the top 3?

                        [–]cgilber11 24 points25 points  (7 children)

                        Not sure, but probably metal gear solid and final fantasy 7? I grew up in the 90s. I really like Stardew valley tho.

                        [–]alksreddit 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                        I'm on the same boat. System Shock 2 is my #1 in my case. I play it almost every year. Unparalleled immersion, and I love trying weird builds on lower difficulties to see what I can get away with.

                        [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

                        I also think it's a game that will sell super well on sale. $40 for a remake of an old PC game, even a great one, is a hard sell for a lot of people, and I can confidently say System Shock is still fairly niche in 2023.

                        Although it's definitely right up the alley of Nightdives target audience.

                        [–]cgilber11 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                        30-40 seems really close to the sweet spot for a remake.

                        [–]Levelman123 43 points44 points  (4 children)

                        Never played the original, feels like im a god damn rat being toyed with by shodan, slowly chewing away at her wires. The maze like level design is actually pretty fun because of how shodan repopulates the station. Finally Turned off those bots on security I might actually be free?!

                        [–]SigilSC2 25 points26 points  (0 children)

                        Never played the original, feels like im a god damn rat being toyed with by shodan, slowly chewing away at her wires.

                        That's the point in the original, and the remake delivered on it. I can get why it wouldn't fit well with a lot of people but I thoroughly loved System Shock 2 and it's very cool to go back and play the first game with minimal changes except for graphics and bringing it into modern controls/UI.

                        [–]Arxae 16 points17 points  (2 children)

                        maze like level design

                        There is an audio log in the game that justifies why the level design is like that. Doesn't really affect anything, but it's a neat touch. Can't remember if the audio log was also there in the original though.

                        Spoiler: TriOptimum designed the Citadel station to be unpleasant to live in/navigate to see how it would affect people psychologically. Basically seeing how long it takes for people to get space cabine fever

                        [–]SixFootTurkey_ 6 points7 points  (1 child)

                        It was not in the original.

                        I get that it's supposed to be an excuse for the labyrinth, but IMO it feels too much like a Fallout joke and breaks the 4th wall.

                        [–]Arxae 4 points5 points  (0 children)

                        Yeah i figured. It's been to long ago since i last played SS1. I didn't mind it too much though, but i understand your reasoning

                        [–]Rebecca_Romijn_AMA 10 points11 points  (1 child)

                        Were the controller sensitivity issues from the last demo addressed for the full release?

                        [–]Fellhuhn 17 points18 points  (0 children)

                        Controller still has several issues.

                        [–]KatoMacabre 16 points17 points  (9 children)

                        I've always heard about System Shock 2's storyline and writing being super good and interesting and all the spiritual connections to Bioshock and all that. What I'm wondering is, without knowing anything about System Shock, is the first one anything like it? Because I don't like fps much, but if it has a meaty interesting story behind it, I'd definitely like to try it.

                        [–]Fullbryte[🍰] 28 points29 points  (0 children)

                        Not just spiritual connections, Ken Levine was lead designer and writer of System Shock 2

                        [–]GepardenK 24 points25 points  (2 children)

                        It's a similar vibe to the story. You will feel very familiar coming from ss2/bio. Although it doesn't have a fancy villain twist like the one from SS2 and it's copy in Bio. SHODAN is a treat, though, and a bit more insane than clever, which is actually very interesting.

                        Combat in this remake is a bit slower than those other games. Feels a bit more like Resident Evil, maybe, than a traditional fps. It's more about the resources than the action, sort of.

                        [–]KatoMacabre 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                        Thanks for the detailed reply! I think I'll give it a go just in case it clicks with me :)

                        [–]Xerand 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                        I really like the duality of combat. Normally it's as you said. Slow, methodical. Sneaking, peaking corners and popping heads while watching that ammo count. Then the sh.t hits the fans, you are getting swarmed, ambushed or are up against Cortex or other bosses. At that point you just enable shield and your plasma rollers, perhaps to bring out that rapier, and suddenly it turns from very slow horror tactical shooter into twitch shooter with a speed that would make Doom Guy proud. Hacker isn't someone you mess with

                        [–]shodan13 7 points8 points  (3 children)

                        SS2 has amazing voice acting for the time, you can follow the individual stories of different people via logs and it's all very visceral. The combat balance is all over the place though, especially towards the end so there's some room for improvement there. Also really fun RPG elements and one of the better and less annoying minigames I've seen.

                        [–]PlasticCogLiquid 4 points5 points  (1 child)

                        This remake feels kind of like they SS2'd SS1. I dig it, 2 was my favorite

                        [–]RememberCitadel 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                        Mine too. I can hear in my head basically any sound the enemies made just by thinking about it.

                        [–]RememberCitadel 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                        SS2 is my favorite game by far. They improved on many things, but one chief thing I think was that you found multiple logs for specific crew members detailing their struggles. For SS1, you rarely get multiple logs for any crew. It really pulled you into the story. That amd the two main enemies facing off agaisnt each other really threw an exciting wrench in things.

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                          [–]Hero2Zero91 6 points7 points  (1 child)

                          Been having a great time with it as someone who hasn't played the original, one of the gripes I do have is that the melee feels like it has no feedback at all.

                          [–]SixFootTurkey_ 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                          one of the gripes I do have is that the melee feels like it has no feedback at all.

                          Honestly it somehow feels much worse than it used to; earlier demos had some feedback but now there really is none.

                          [–]mRWafflesFTW 43 points44 points  (10 children)

                          I want to play it but it has horrific head bob and I cannot find a way to disable it. Anyone know how to turn it off? Makes me so motion sick.

                          [–]GepardenK 79 points80 points  (3 children)

                          There is a option to turn off headbob. There is also a option to remove the curvature of the UI - which helped a lot for me.

                          [–]mRWafflesFTW 22 points23 points  (2 children)

                          Where is the option to turn off the head bob? I don't see it anywhere.

                          [–]GepardenK 13 points14 points  (1 child)

                          No you're right, I was misremembering. I thought I had turned it off because I didn't experience any.

                          Turns out the game doesn't have head bobbing. I think the effect you're experiencing is that the weapon/hands will bob up and down as you move, creating the illusion of head bobbing, but the camera itself is not affected and stays smooth at all times. Those weapon animations cannot be turned off I'm afraid.

                          [–]mRWafflesFTW 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                          It definitely has a head bob effect even without the animations. Just walking in the apartment the bob is super apparent and sucks!

                          [–]sakezaf123 30 points31 points  (0 children)

                          Oh, it's the headbob? I was getting motion sick playing it as well. Setting the fov to 110 helped a lot, but I was wondering why, since 90 is usually fine for me.

                          [–]Kr4k4J4Ck 22 points23 points  (0 children)

                          horrific head bob

                          Due to the fact I turn off headbob in every game I play and don't even notice this one. I wouldn't say it's horrific at all.

                          [–]FarCryRedux 5 points6 points  (0 children)

                          Ahh man, I love this type of head bob. It feels very subtle to me.

                          I'm playing at 108 FOV (110 cyberspace) on a 16:10 panel. Try raising the FOV way up and see if that helps.

                          https://www.nexusmods.com/systemshock2023/mods/24

                          [–]FarCryRedux 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                          https://www.nexusmods.com/systemshock2023/mods/24

                          [–]Reasonabledwarf 1 point2 points  (1 child)

                          Hey! Good news! They just added a toggle for the head bob in a patch.

                          [–]mRWafflesFTW 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                          Hell ya thanks!

                          [–]hoodvisions 2 points3 points  (2 children)

                          Really loved the game back then! Tried the demo yesterday and realized a big part of the hype was revolutionary gameplay mechanics which happen to be a chore for nowadays. Guess I became too much of a casual gamer.

                          [–]SixFootTurkey_ 1 point2 points  (1 child)

                          a big part of the hype was revolutionary gameplay mechanics which happen to be a chore for nowadays

                          Which mechanics do you mean? Just a bit curious.

                          [–]hoodvisions 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                          Collecting various items of which some are he garbage, others requiring to read into and test properly, reading logs, swapping perks and stats. It was a huge thing coming from games like Quake or Daggerfall.

                          [–]hombregato 6 points7 points  (2 children)

                          I guess we can add System Shock 1 to the best games of 2023, alongside Metroid Prime, Resident Evil 4, Persona 4, Dead Space 1, and The Last of Us Part 1.

                          [–]longtimelurkerfirs 3 points4 points  (0 children)

                          Ok so the best games of 2023 includes games from 2008, 2005, 2013 and 1994 haha

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                            [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (4 children)

                            so I don't remember the original at all, but picked up the remake. Either I was naturally god-like at this when I was young, I used cheats, or I thought I was awesome but never progressed at all? This isn't Quake or CoD..kinda difficult game? ;)

                            [–]SixFootTurkey_ 1 point2 points  (3 children)

                            Original was definitely easier.

                            [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

                            man, I just got annihilated by mobs with energy weapons and what I assume were autoturrents, I'm barely 30m in and I even adjusted the diff downwards somewhat as a first test playthrough to get a feel for it before re-rerolling and trying to beat it, had beat the hell outta 1 or 2 of those kinda harmless dr-who-esque bot thingies with my pipe, turned a corner and ZAP

                            [–]Grug16 2 points3 points  (1 child)

                            Security cyborgs fire in long bursts so its best to hide between volleys. As for the hoppers (laser robots) they cant shoot while moving so best to try to evade them at first. Teflon bullets also get through their armor better. If you are feeling brave, use a berserk stim and try to get behind the hopper and take advantage of its slow turn speed.

                            [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                            John Linneman sort of has a fetish for games from this era and this type of game in particular so no doubt he's in love with it playing like it did back in the day. I'd take what he says with a pinch of salt.

                            [–]Djxgam1ng 2 points3 points  (9 children)

                            Can someone convince me either to buy or not buy this game? Only been gaming on PC for a while 2020, but prior, was always playing the latest games for Xbox and PlayStation. Trying to decide if I should get this or SF? By the way, Diablo IV is my first Diablo game (haven’t had time to sit down and play it) and I haven’t played a fighting game since Arcade Days (early 2000’s). Hearing good stuff about this system shock game.

                            [–]bathory21 6 points7 points  (4 children)

                            If you like space horror, and enjoyed games like Prey, Deus Ex, Thief, etc you will like this as it is from the same genre of immersive sims. It has one of the best villains in gaming. I can't say whether you should buy this over Street Fighter because they're both different games but I personally think you won't regret this game if you liked the aforementioned games

                            [–]Arxae 5 points6 points  (1 child)

                            You also have to mention that the game is almost a copy of the original (in a good way), but that also brings with it the bad parts. It can be very obtuse, your objectives are said in audio logs (that you can miss). And the times they do explicitly tell you what to do, they are still quite vague about it. Some situations are unfair (good old monster closets basically). Maps are large and labyrinthine. And cyberspace is..still in the game unfortunately.

                            The game is really a coat of paint on top of the original. It feels like playing the original, but with a better control scheme, better inventory and better graphics/sound. And if you are ok with that, 10/10 recommend it. If you like a more modern approach to gameplay, but still want the SS experience, play Prey 2017.

                            [–]RememberCitadel 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                            Everything you said is spot on.

                            Its funny, I played the first one when I was a little kid, and I could only play for short spurts before I got scared, at least for the first few hours. I was maybe 8 or so.

                            With the remake, the nostalgia hit so hard I felt the same feeling of fear from when I was a kid. I had to put it down after maybe an hour the first day. Even the enhanced edition didn't do that for me, although that maybe because it was too close to the original and I had already conquered that fear.

                            [–]Djxgam1ng 0 points1 point  (1 child)

                            One thing I will say, and kind of embarrassed to admit it, is I have never played any of those games you mentioned. I think I may have tried Thief on my Xbox1X a few years ago, but probably quit due to frustration. (In my earlier days of gaming, I would get stressed out and angry, throw my controller and just get heated if I couldn’t get past past certain points in any game). I no longer act like that. I currently feel like a loser and an idiot for admiring that and feel even more stupid because I don’t know any of those games you listed. Sorry for this response. I am a loser and a failure. I hate myself and sorry again for responding this way.

                            [–]bathory21 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                            Hey man, no worries, you're not a loser or a failure. I haven't played anyof those games until recently either. For my money, I'd get System Shock but a bit of a warnin, it doesn't hold your hand in terms of teling you what you need to do unless you lower your difficulty. Its story is told through audio logs. I find it amazinf becase of is unique atmosphere

                            [–]SixFootTurkey_ 2 points3 points  (0 children)

                            Core appeals:

                            • Survival horror w/ cyberpunk flair

                            • Exploration-driven experience; get lost in a dungeon-crawling labyrinth of mutants and cyborgs

                            [–]-undecided- 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                            Theres a free Demo, give it a go see how it feels.

                            If you like Bioshock or Prey you will probably enjoy it.

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                              [–]Deathisnear24 -1 points0 points  (5 children)

                              I really wanted to try to power through this but I just couldn't after playing the demo for about an hour.

                              I was really enjoying my time with it but I don't think I can stare at the same blue walls the entire game. Every room just kinda started to meld together for me and it made it super hard to navigate around the game. I wish there was more variety in the wall texture colors instead of just blue, and blue with glowy bits.

                              [–]PugSwagMaster 7 points8 points  (1 child)

                              I mean, it's only the first level that's blue.

                              [–]jonjonaug 2 points3 points  (2 children)

                              Different floors have different textures, but the game is extremely claustrophobic pretty much the whole way through.

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